NHL Trade Deadline Open Thread Vol. 2 - The Toskalol-ing
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 11:45 AM PST
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PrintWith the main thread over 400 comments, let's move on for the rest of the afternoon, shall we?
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Streaming is godly
even if I had to spend the day working.
Phaneuf and Kovalchuk were already gone. There wasn’t much left to move.
On the bright side, you aren’t at work. OTOH, I am doing the same thing you are, but getting paid for it! ;)
This guy is our goalie!
Woo!
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 11:53 AM PST up reply actions
whatever, wallin scored on his own net and i think it was a great pickup for the sharks.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 11:57 AM PST up reply actions
This is true.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 11:58 AM PST up reply actions
Sheldon Souray is in hospital with a Hand infection. It is serious and he’s probably done for the year.
Shit Happens.
Souray must have looked at Iginla’s wife funny in the summer or something.
Fear the curse of Jarome Arthur-Leigh Adekunle Tig Junior Elvis Iginla!
by Resolute on Mar 3, 2010 11:56 AM PST up reply actions 2 recs
I love how we say “rec’d” on this blog, but never actually do, lol.
by Resolute on Mar 3, 2010 12:04 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
rec’d
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:05 PM PST up reply actions
lol
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:05 PM PST up reply actions
How does Junior Elvis get in there? I’ve always wondered. Must have been his mom.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 11:57 AM PST up reply actions
Ah. that makes much more sense now.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 11:59 AM PST up reply actions
Well, unless something else happened that we do not yet know about, this deadline sucked.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:02 PM PST up reply actions
If nothing else is announced for the Flames by the NHL by the time he takes the podium, there will not be anything more. The NHL has to offically announce trades before the GM’s can talk about them.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:07 PM PST up reply actions
Oskar Osala. That is a great name.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:11 PM PST up reply actions
holy shitters, who the eff is gonna play in carolina ??!? the albany river rats are gonna need loaners.
They have Eric Staal. “That guy’s like a fucking wookie on skates.”
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:12 PM PST up reply actions
well boyd is still here, so i would imagine there’s something else coming.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:13 PM PST up reply actions
The most amazing thing is that they won the Cup 3 years ago. 3 Years from top to cellar! How does that happen??
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:13 PM PST up reply actions
Very good point.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:16 PM PST up reply actions
personally, i think they’ll be contenders again in a year or two. they’ve got some good vets, good coaching, good management. so they built a winner (i might point out they BEAT the oil) and now they’re re-building. no shame in that at all.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:22 PM PST up reply actions
Oh, I think they will be a playoff team next year. I just find it fascinating how things can turn so fast. Conversely with the Pens and Kings.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:26 PM PST up reply actions
Winners so far.
Phoenix
- Most active and pulled the steal of the day in getting Woitjk Wolski.
Washington
- Acquired depth and a defensemen in Corvo & Jurcina
Toronto
- They got what they wanted, Picks plus a solid prospect and they can get rid of Kaberle at the draft when his NTC is nullified because the Leafs will miss the playoffs.
Losers
Philadelphia
- Didn’t get Hamhuis, Didn’t get a Goalie, Didn’t get squat.
Fringe
Calgary
- Get a backup goalie who’s 4 Million comes off the book in the Summer, though as of yet no draft picks and still has 5 NHL contracts as scratches for tonight.
Shit Happens.
for a 4th round pick. that’s fucking bullshit.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:36 PM PST up reply actions
Boyd to the Preds for a fourth? Poor return for a guy who was a third rounder. Blah. Kind of a waste. Might as well have let him go to RFA and arbitration.
y’know what ? i actually hope this team tanks now. i want the flames to totally shit the bed and we can have a new management team. that is absolute fucking bullshit.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:39 PM PST up reply actions
Steve Y nearly fucked the bed on Team Canada, which should be one of the easiest teams to pick out. Pass on him.
with the result, RO, wouldn’t you suggest perhaps that team canada might have nearly fucked the bed on team canada ?
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:56 PM PST up reply actions
No, Team Canada is probably the hardest team to pick out. The easy teams are the ones where you don’t have very many real options.
Seriously? Not really. Just pick the best players. They got cute on the defense instead of picking the best.
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 1:03 PM PST up reply actions
Define “best”.
I mean, I’m not disagreeing that they got a bit cute on defense. Even Steve Y mentioned that he wished that he made some different choices in retrospect…or he would have if they had lost.
Seriously, though, you could pick a whole second Canadian team and still have a group that could be a medal contender.
Plus, at the end of the day the single elimination format means any team can fail, and the talent pool in Canada is deep enough that any choice you make will be second-guessed.
Like, what is the fucking point in getting a 4th rounder from a playoff team? Espically for a roster player that is #10 or higher on the depth chart.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:41 PM PST up reply actions
This takes the cake.
Wow we have two 4th Round picks and one 3rd.
Please tell me something else is coming the other way from Nashville.
Shit Happens.
My primary objection to this deal is that Dustin Boyd is an actual NHL player, albeit a limited one who’s development seems to have stalled. They traded him for a minimal chance at a NHL player. That’s shit asset management.
the other thing that kills me about this is that dustin boyd (exactly like lombo) has the potential to be a very useful player and a fourth round draft pick is generally a throwaway.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:47 PM PST up reply actions
If you think so highly of Boyd, then why did you want Backlund on this roster? The guy’s not ready, he’s not served well by being up here. But I recall you were super happy to see Backlund called up.
hey, don’t get me wrong —i love backlund and i’m glad he’s getting a chance. i’m just trying to figure out who the centres are on this team, though, and i’m thinking that the org has chosen conroy over boyd. that is not a hockey decision.
stajan, langkow, backlund………. ?
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
here’s where i’ll be raging: if conroy draws back in this season AT ALL. cause there’s no way someone can tell me that conroy > boyd in any capacity.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:53 PM PST up reply actions
Conroy over Boyd is totally a hockey decision, if Conroy is healthy then Boyd isn’t fit to carry his golf clubs, and I’m a Boyd fan.
Problem here is that the org has clearly chosen Backlund over Boyd for the softest minutes role, and that doesn’t serve a project like Backlund at all. Nor does it serve the team, you can bet your bottom dollar that Backlund over Boyd will hurt this team.
we will agree to disagree on this one too, RO.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:54 PM PST up reply actions
Would you all be happier if it was Boyd for a second? Because the difference between fourth and a second, when you’re paying with a salary-controlled actual NHLer, is nil in my mind.
The real crime here isn’t that Boyd was traded, it’s that Backlund’s moved up the depth chart over Boyd despite not showing that he can play at this level (seriously, he’s not yet ready for the speed of the NHL, he makes very odd decisions in transition and on the cycle). Nobody’s complaining about that, but that’s the crime here. The writing was on the wall when Backlund was recalled the second time.
You aren’t hearing that from me, amigo. I wanted Backlund in the AHL for the year, and a better third line center acquired from elsewhere.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 12:50 PM PST up reply actions
No, but you’re sane Robert. I am just pointing out the hypocrisy from others of crying about this deal and simultaneously wanting to see Backlund on the big league roster.
The Boyd trade is garbage. It’s garbage asset management, it’s a garbage return in this market. We trade Kevin Lalande for a 4th round pick.
Sigh.
Well, yeah, it’s a garbage trade, but you could see the writing on the wall when Backlund was called up. Why do that? It doesn’t help Backlund develop into a better player, it odesn’t help the big league team, it doesn’t help anybyody.
I called Boyd being traded days ago. I knew it was going to happen. But for a 4th rounder? Jesus, might as well be a bag of pucks. Dude was a third round pick. If we had made this deal a couple of years ago while he was still in the AHL it wouldn’t be a value trade.
PHX moves Mueller for Wolski and the Flames get a 9% chance at another NHLer for Dustin Boyd.
If they moved for a second then it’s only a 25% chance. Either way, the bigger picture is that they decided to take that 3/4 centre slot and fill it with a non-NHL player, and then take the NHL player who failed to get the spot and turn him into a low-probability bet on an NHL player.
I understand where you’re coming from, we’re on the same page here re: hating this trade, but I hate the fact that we had to make this trade in the first place. We didn’t have to, not at all. We could have thrown Mr. Potential, Mikael Backlund, at Colorado and gotten ourselves a bona fide impact player.
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 1:01 PM PST up reply actions
I had no objection to the kid getting a short run when the Flames needed a body. It might have jump-started him when he went back to Abby, and they should have left him down there to finish out the season as the lead dog. There’s a lot to be said for forcing a kid to take a minor-league team and make it his. Next fall, he would have had a good chance for a larger role in Calgary. This is either too much too soon, or they bench him to no good effect. Bah.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 1:03 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah the first time was okay since it was due to Conroy going down. But Conroy’s ready to go now, so when they called him up again… man, terrible.
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 1:04 PM PST up reply actions
I like Backlund on the roster. I also like Boyd on the roster more then Conroy. Simple. Backlund can develop on the NHL level.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 12:53 PM PST up reply actions
Still kinda thought Boyd would warrent at least a replacement level draft pick (3rd Rounder). Odd move, can Boyd apply for arbitration? That’s the only reason I can think of for doing this. Heck, I’m not even a Boyd fanboi and even I think this stinks.
boyd has never been liked by the sutter regime. EVER.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:55 PM PST up reply actions
I think last summer contract negotiations might have hurt the kid. As all of us saw from the Giordano situation, Daz does have his issues when people cross him.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 12:57 PM PST up reply actions
i think gio is the only one who survived that kind of situation…. but that’s also bullshit, IMO.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:04 PM PST up reply actions
Backlund may not be ready but now he has to be ready. If Sutter thinks so highly of Backlund then it’s Backlund’s choice to either make Daz eat his words or prove everyone wrong.
Boyd was a reliable player until Backlund finally made the jump to becoming a legit NHLer. I’ll miss Boyd but I’ll miss him even more if he helps the Preds to a playoff birth well the Flames are on the outside looking in.
Shit Happens.
i’m the opposite now. i hope boyd scores the winning goal for the preds that knocks the flames out of the playoffs and darryl sutter out of his office.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 12:57 PM PST up reply actions
Observe as Boyd puts up .7 ppg through the rest of the season for the Preds, they win the cup, and Sutter drafts a big, stay-at-home defenseman with his 4th round pick
Well thankfully it won’t be Sutter making that 4th Round pick if it comes down to that.
Shit Happens.
Management will replace Darryl Sutter with Brent Sutter. Sweeping changes.
by SmellOfVictory on Mar 3, 2010 12:59 PM PST up reply actions
Terrible trade. TERRIBLE. Jesus, of all the fucking teams that would accept salary dumps from that wasteland up north, it had to be US???
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 1:05 PM PST up reply actions
Yes. I, I,
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK!!!!!!!!!!
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 1:06 PM PST up reply actions
The 3rd round pick goes to Edmonton. So you know, right there, that Sutter really wants Staios.
I mean… I mean…. what? WHAT???
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 1:06 PM PST up reply actions
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA what a joke. i hate the flames.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:06 PM PST up reply actions
Should have forced those bastards up north to take Kotalik-balls back.
The writing’s on the wall for Gio though. Sutter obviously doesn’t want him in the top 4.
I have a feeling Staios will be in the AHL next season.
If Steve Staios ever plays outside the bottom pair, shoot me right now.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 1:10 PM PST up reply actions
Oh I think he will. Sutter gave up the 3rd, I don’t value it at all but the fact that he gave it up means this was a move Sutter wanted, and if he wanted it, that means Staios is in the top 4.
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 1:11 PM PST up reply actions
LOL, well at least I’m going to get some entertainment value out of the fanbase explosion. Trading with the Oilers, har. Was it our third or the BJ’s?
lol. Even if staios was useful, I’d oppose trading with Edmonton on general principle.
I’m not about to go over the deep end on Sutter like others, but damn.
if we can go 0 fer howevermanygamesleft, then all is well. it’s darryl sutter signing his own severance papers.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:18 PM PST up reply actions
Given the favour that the Flames did for the Oilers, shouldn’t the draft pick be going to Calgary instead?
Well today is now the busiest trade deadline although not that fun. Unless your a Caps & Yotes supporter.
Shit Happens.
i don’t understand how you look at the competitive teams in the nhl and say “we need a 35 year old guy.” i don’t understand how you watch the US olympic team and think that you need to make your team older. it’s INSANITY.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:23 PM PST up reply actions
We’d still have Columbus’ 3rd this year.
by SmellOfVictory on Mar 3, 2010 1:24 PM PST up reply actions
the one for stralman
(jeeeeezus, STRALMAN is better than fucking staios)
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:24 PM PST up reply actions
even this simple decision Daz is fucking up…ummm Leland….ever heard of him Daz?
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
Keetley has actually passed him by. Last time I checked Irving was playing in the ECHL with the Victoria Salmon Kings.
Shit Happens.
I still think Irving is better. That’s all that matters. Lol.
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
He is stinking it up in Victoria though. So much for another Daz first rounder.
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
Exactly! but really the way I see are Goalie situation is Kipper will be a Flame till he retires 39,40,41? Irving’s time might pass him by.
Joni Ortio is also up and coming but I think the goalie situation can be addressed when Kipper is ready to call it quits
Shit Happens.
Sooooooo...
What exactly does Daz have for picks this Summer if EDM elects to snare their 3rd this season…
"It's a great day for hockey" - BBJ
by jealous broadcaster on Mar 3, 2010 1:25 PM PST reply actions
two fourths. ours and nashville’s (for boyd)
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:27 PM PST up reply actions
Ok, all gnashing of teeth aside for this year (not going forward) from the Sutterite Colonies perspective. We didn’t do to badly.
Calgary Traded (In the Sutterites opinion): A forward who lost his spot on the roster and wasn’t going to play, a #7 d-man, the worst back-up goaltender in the NHL, and a third round pick
Calgary Got: A better back-up goaltender, a d-man whose better then #7, a fourth round pick.
Just think about their perspective.
Agreed and what makes it better is that Toskala’s 4 Mill come off at the end of the season.
I’m not angry, I’m more disappointed that you couldn’t get a little more for Boyd.
Shit Happens.
Staios is a negative asset at his price. He’s $2.7M next year, 35 years old and well on the decline. He’s a salary dump for the Oilers. The Flames did them a favor by accepting him in a trade.
The Flames needed to rid themselves of poor middle tier contracts, not add another one.
Ideally yes Pardy. So is Staois better, worse, about the same compared to Pardy. If the answer is better or about the same then the team comes out on top this year (not next) Unless you think Aaron Johnson is better then both.
The difference either way is neglibile. It gets the Flames nothing in the short term and costs them a bunch of cap space (that could be much better spent) next year. And yet another draft pick.
If Pardy had less skill then both Staios and Sarich (I’m not saying he does, in fact, I think the opposite) I still would rather have him then either of the other 2.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 1:39 PM PST up reply actions
If they’d made the deal for a commensurate UFA defenceman (bottom pairing or 7th guy, but better than Johnson), I could have understood this on a competitive level, since Darryl’s paranoid about being caught short on the back end. This? No.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 1:40 PM PST up reply actions
I’m not saying it’s a good deal anytime other then now, it’s a lousy deal next year, but for right now, this season it’s not bad. We got a better #7 d-man (either in Staois or Pardy). Is it a lousy future returns deal? Heck ya. Is it a lousy right now deal? No, not really.
It’s very shortsighted but Daz isn’t looking to far off with this one.
I understand your position, but the truth is the potential returns in the short term aren’t anywhere near the future cost with Staios.
Funny you just did the whole Cap Analysis… and DS goes and mangles it all up with Staios!
"It's a great day for hockey" - BBJ
by jealous broadcaster on Mar 3, 2010 1:58 PM PST up reply actions
I’ll do it again tomorrow when I can look at this stuff with some distance, JB. No worries.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 2:03 PM PST up reply actions
Tight tight tight is how the cap looks for next year… I can’t see them signing more than two of the following…
a) Ian White
b) Higgins
c) A back-up that doesn’t blow
d) the annual Sutter Goon
"It's a great day for hockey" - BBJ
by jealous broadcaster on Mar 3, 2010 2:11 PM PST up reply actions
Ummm…yeah. I can hope that this means Sarich is done, but realistically it means White or Gio is done.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
white is RFA at the end of the year. perhaps staios is an insurance policy on losing him
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:28 PM PST up reply actions
There’s cheaper insurance than that. The UFA market for decent D is not terrible.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 1:29 PM PST up reply actions
i’m not saying i agree with it, i’m saying maybe that’s what he’s doing.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:30 PM PST up reply actions
If we lose White, we traded Dion for Stajan and Hagman. If we lose Gio, you have to buy a new jersey AND we lose our 2nd best d-man.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 1:30 PM PST up reply actions
gio’s signed through for another year. i don’t see him getting dealt until this time next year…. at which time, if darryl sutter is at the helm, i GUARANTEE he’s gone.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:31 PM PST up reply actions
Ahh. I’m not sure why I thought Gio was expiring.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 1:37 PM PST up reply actions
So this is what we are looking at tonight
Hagman-Stajan-Iginla
Higgins-Langkow-Kotalik
Bourque-Backlund-Moss
Glencross-Nystrom-Mayers
Bouwmeester-Giordano
Regehr-White
Sarich-Pardy
Kipper
Keetley
Shit Happens.
i guess that makes pardy the number 7 when staios arrives, even though i’d rather have him then sarich or staios…
staios could totally make it for 8pm. will he draw in ?
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:28 PM PST up reply actions
I think Sutter has a greater purpose. He is trying to restore balance to the NHL. Every trade he has made, he has taken players who were outperforming their contracts/good value as well as draft picks, and traded them for more expensive players who were worse/underperforming and in the same position. I believe that, by draft day, he will take the entire Flames team (Iginla, Kipper, Langks, JBo and Bourque will be traded for Moreau, Horcoff, and Souray to complete his task) and fly them out to a deserted island in an effort to help fix some of the terrible contracts throughout the NHL.
as far as toskala goes, i wouldnt mind seeing him signed to like a 1 year 1.5 million deal as a solid backup. Daz probably sees him and thinks 4 years 10 million though.
I am going to laugh so hard...
Game 7 of the Stanley Cup Finals. Kipper gets run by Ovechkin (who deserved a major for the infraction, but the officials, impressed by his “enthusiasm”, overlooks it). Vesa Toskala comes on for the third period and makes six fantastic saves off Washington chances (none off Green’s stick, cause he disappears in the playoffs). The seventh chance (omg is our Corsi getting slaughtered!) is a fantastic, Cup saving block by Staios, with the loose puck picked up by White, who passes to Stajan, over to Backlund who quickly flips to Iggy to give the Flames a 4-3 lead.
Washington buzzes the Flames net for the last three minutes straight, with the series ending after Kotalik comes flying into the crease to make an amazing save at the buzzer after Toskala is pushed out of the net by Ovechkin (great heart, kid!), and the Flames win the Stanley Cup!
I’ll give him 5 million a year with a no trade clause.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 1:37 PM PST up reply actions
Apparently the pharmaceutical supply in Calgary is quite fulsome, Res. Send me the script for whatever you’re taking ;-)
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 1:33 PM PST up reply actions
They’ve got 18+Mil committed to 6 D for next season and have to ink Ian White to a new deal.
Hope you like the D-core… it looks like it could be static for a while
"It's a great day for hockey" - BBJ
by jealous broadcaster on Mar 3, 2010 1:34 PM PST reply actions
If Staios can usher is 05-06 form that would just great.
Also I didn’t know he was a Canuck either.
Shit Happens.
Reggie, Sarich and Staios seem to be in decline… that isn’t a nice trend
"It's a great day for hockey" - BBJ
by jealous broadcaster on Mar 3, 2010 1:37 PM PST reply actions
exactly !!!! and they all have one more facking year !!!
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 1:37 PM PST up reply actions
somewhere this man is laughing...
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
by KingJafi on Mar 3, 2010 1:39 PM PST reply actions 2 recs
I knew that was gonna show up!
rec’d
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 1:40 PM PST up reply actions
The Flames are paying him, Res. I doubt he minds spending his days on TV.
I don’t miss him, though.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 1:45 PM PST up reply actions
Because, he’s getting two paychecks one from the Flames to do nothing and another from TSN to talk. And he get’s to smirk because at this time last year the Flames that he coached were winning the division and this one is fighting for it’s playoff life and the guy who fired him is doing really stupid things? It’d put a smile on my face.
…and you don’t think Sutter should take any of that blame…or the 4 first round exits…or the one solid first rounder (who is now gone)…or McBackup…etc etc etc??
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
i would give sutter MOST of that blame…. well, sutter or holditch (whomever was resposible for the cap fiasco)
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 2:12 PM PST up reply actions
Here’s something to chew on.
The last Forward the Flames drafted that turned into something pretty good was Theo Fleury in 1987. Darryl inherited crap, ran into a lockout.
Shit Happens.
Daz has milked the shit out of Jarome, the Kipper acquisition, and the ‘04 run…it’s bought him some years but the recent facts are simple…last year’s collapse albeit some injuries but at the same time cap problems…3 coaches in 4 years…and 4 first round exits. All that would be salvageable if they make it out of the first round this year…but with all these trades and bizarre acquisitions that seems less and less likely everyday. Mind you, I am well aware that Daz will be back next yer….I think RO or Bob pointed out to me on this site earlier this week that if his job was on shaky ground, ownership would never approve all these moves and signings.
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
I don’t know cause he was a fall guy to an extent. Imo, that wasn’t right. You’ve pointed it out to me that I’m obviously not a Daz supporter which you’re right about but Daz was a partner in crime with Keenan and he’s just continuing his earth scorching even with Keenan gone. That right there might be humorous to Mike as well as what Bob and Parallel point out: the Flames are still paying him.
I’ve also posted this picture and comment multiple times…its a funny picture…and now I pretty much simply do it as a joke (as Justin pointed out) which you don’t funny. My apologies.
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
Phx sends Chad Kolarik to CBJ for Alex Picard according to DD. Good trade for the yotes i think, i like picard. Good day for them.
I want Phoenix to do so well this spring if the Flames are either eliminated or don’t make it. I’ll be wearing white all the time.
Shit Happens.
Me too. I actually got to watch two Phoenix games when I was in Arizona earlier this year. It’s a good, hard-working team (and that was before these trades). If the Flames don’t make the playoffs and/or have an early exist, I’ll be rooting for the ’Yotes.
Of course, if the ‘Yotes were to actually make some noise in the playoffs, Jim Balsillie’s head may explode. Which would be pretty entertaining too.
Jermaine Franklin: “Where do you go from here, McBackup?”
McBackup: “Anaheim. I go to Anaheim.”
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
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$3,845,835… That’s the Flames Cap Space heading into the off-season.
17 Players signed.
UFA: Nystrom, Higgins, Mayers, Conroy, McGoon, Toskala
RFA: White,
Needs: Back up, 3-4 forwards
"It's a great day for hockey" - BBJ
by jealous broadcaster on Mar 3, 2010 1:45 PM PST reply actions
All of those forwards can go except Higgins. White needs to be resigned, but I don’t think he will be, and there are cheap options for backups. Forward wise, they would need one more and maybe Nemisz or Wahl would be ready.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 1:48 PM PST up reply actions
Peer pressure from where? Mayfield psychiatric hospital?
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 1:55 PM PST up reply actions
Not sure why you would want to at this point. This team looks like my 4 year old sister picked names that she thought looked pretty.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:00 PM PST up reply actions
just read about how you guys have toskala now. ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!
imagine if kipper got injured….. oh boy, would vancouver be enjoying it!!
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no offense, of course, but still….
Official Ambassador for Nucks Misconduct.
Canadian beer is better than Miller, but I only like my vodka.
GO CANUCKS GO!
on the brightside, he is the best acquisition we got all day….
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
that actually sounds rather depressing.
Official Ambassador for Nucks Misconduct.
Canadian beer is better than Miller, but I only like my vodka.
GO CANUCKS GO!
This is the last time I’ll say this.
His 4 Million comes off the books in the Summer. 4 Million we can play with.
Shit Happens.
2.7 of which now goes straight into Staios’ bank account.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:06 PM PST up reply actions
Provided ownership doesn’t mind he can be waived, or demoted (Oh god… please tell me he doesn’t have a NMC). Heck we took him so maybe we could even find a taker. Cap implications are complicated but the team is not without options.
Even if he had a NMC, it would be moot at this point. Teams acquiring a player are not obligated to honour a NTC/NMC signed with another team.
Are you absolutely certain? Kotalik’s NTC still exists.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:14 PM PST up reply actions
usually they are, methinks. otherwise they’d get traded to a team they like and then immediately moved to a team they hate.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 2:15 PM PST up reply actions
Add Kotalik, Lanks and Jbouw, take out Hagman.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:20 PM PST up reply actions
Capgeek is the best place.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:22 PM PST up reply actions
NMC means no trades, no send-downs, no nothing. The player can only be dressed or scratched. NTC just means they cannot be traded. Both of them can be waived.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:24 PM PST up reply actions
I think the best acquisition we got was the 4th rounder from Nashville.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:05 PM PST up reply actions
lol.
Maybe Daz will draft himself cause nobody does it better than Daz.
"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.
Well Darryl’s son won’t turn out to much
Brent’s is looking pretty good.
So hopefully Duane’s will be better then Brett and Brandon.
Shit Happens.
brent’s lookin’ pretty good where ? here ?
ps: i told myself i’d never post that. but there it is for your viewing pleasure.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 2:17 PM PST up reply actions
Was he eating…a rose?
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:21 PM PST up reply actions
oh no it’s not. my comp is just waaaay slow.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 2:18 PM PST up reply actions
I just popped by to laugh maniacally and uncontrollably.
But I’m not that mean, really. Or I stopped giving a shit in November. You decide.
My condolences on Toskala, though. I mean, shit, wouldn’t a shooter tutor and a hat rack from Ikea have fulfilled the role more than adequately for much cheaper?
SNN Sports - A theoretical Oilers blog (i.e. theoretically, I write stuff there). Link now 100% less broken.
A empty net would have been scored on less times then 3 win, so Toskalol is a slight improvement.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:19 PM PST up reply actions
Toskalol for Mc3Win-Ok, so we traded a guy who is awful for a guy who is slightly less awful. Fair enough.
Boyd for Franchise player-Conroy should be on IR for the rest of the season. I love the guy, know him well, but he is just not as good as Boyd is in any facet of the on-ice game.
7th D-man who makes a mil for Staios-Daz is out of his fucking mind.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
*peeks around*
Kent or Robert, mind giving me the lowdown on Dustin Boyd? Putting together a post…
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you’re gonna love him the way phoenix loves lombardi. same guy, more or less.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 2:41 PM PST up reply actions
He’s really fucking good at NHL 10 and Halo
by Rod Blogojevich on Mar 3, 2010 2:43 PM PST up reply actions
He’s a player who’s development seems to have plateaued. A decent 3rd or 4th liner, he has some speed, some skill, and is able to kill penalties.
If, however, the change of scenery leads to more development, then he will be a good 2nd line two way centre.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 2:43 PM PST up reply actions
He’s also pretty easy to knock off the puck.
Pros: Decent Speed, Solid north-south game, hard worker
Cons: Not exceptional at anything, needs to be physically stronger, development has seemingly plateaued here in Calgary
*note —-this is pretty much word for word what was said about lombo a year ago.
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 2:55 PM PST up reply actions
Lombo a year ago…
Pros: Fantastic Speed, Excellent on the PK, Adaquate playmaker
Cons: No finishing skills, dispite being given every opportunity could not performin the top 6, undersized
… I don’t weep for Matthew Lombardi & I won’t weep for Dustin Boyd only for the lack of return we’ve gotten for him
how bout the lack of return for lombo ?
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 3:04 PM PST up reply actions
I’ve nicknamed this year’s TDL “THE GREAT TRADE DEADLINE TRAVESTY”.
I doubt you need to read to know how I feel about it.
Oh, in between crashes I read that we’ve traded Riley Armstrong for some guy. Small deal I know but I just thought I’d mention it.
As much as I hate these trades, and yes, I do hate them, we are talking ourselves into some really stupid shit of late.
Some examples:
- Boyd better than Conroy – verifiably false
- Stajan higher than Langkow on any depth chart – lunacy
- Simultaneously supporting Backlund on this roster and decrying the Boyd trade – hypocrisy
- Wanting to see the Flames fail because of these trades – don’t let the door hit you on the way out
- Toskala deal being good because his cap hit will be off the books – well if we didn’t trade for him we’d have his $4M anyway.
Please people, let’s get back to reality.
- The Staios deal blows chunks and hard, and will almost certainly force the Flames to spend $2.2M in the minors next season. It sucks, and I’d be fighting mad if it was my money, but it’s not my money.
- The Boyd deal was stupid, but the real travesty is having Backlund on the big league roster in the first place. I was vociferous, and mostly alone, actually, in not wanting him on the roster. “Give him a chance!” everyone said. Well, we gave him a chance, he’s not helping the team, and Boyd’s gone for a bag of pucks. Well fucking done.
- McElhinney for Toskala is a sideways move. Toskala is a terrible goalie. McElhinney may be an average goalie but his window of opportunity has run out. We’d be screwed if either were forced to start games for us on a regular basis. Let’s just hope Kipper doesn’t get injured.
Boyd might not be better than Conroy last year, but this year they’re more different than one being better than the other (Boyd is faster, has appeared more dangerous in the O-zone to me, Conroy better defensively).
Stajan higher than Langkow on a depth chart – not as insane as you make it out to be. The major argument to make for Langkow is the underlying stat/“grit” argument. He’s a tough little SOB, and he’s certainly good at putting the puck closer to the opposing net, but his hands are leaving him, which is something that Stajan has on him (in addition to faceoffs).
And I support Backlund. That doesn’t mean I can’t be unhappy with the Boyd trade. I’m not unhappy with the fact that Boyd was traded, but that we got such a godawful shitty return for him (in addition, if we did keep him I’d rather have him over half the 3rd/4th liners we’ve got right now).
by SmellOfVictory on Mar 3, 2010 3:41 PM PST up reply actions
Langkow plays tough minutes for this club and ends up on the better side of territory and scoring chances. He helps this team win more than any other center. He is the man, Stajan has yet to prove himself.
Despite all the style differences, Conroy still ended up on the better side of his chances, in fact IIRC he led the team in this regard at one point. If Boyd even approached Conroy’s effectiveness, you’d know – the M&G server would go down from all the profanity I would be laying down right now.
And faceoffs…. man, it doesn’t even matter. My back-of-the-envelope calculations for the effect of being a 60% faceoff team instead of a 50% faceoff team is 3 goals per season. That’s 1 whole point, and paying one of your centres millions to be good at faceoffs is lunacy. Get the guys who are hard on the puck and drive the play.
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 3:58 PM PST up reply actions
I think looking at straight FO% is too simplistic for it, as you certainly need players who make use of the faceoff wins (ie if you’ve got a 3rd liner who wins a ton of faceoffs but no one on the line can score to save their lives, then it’s going to skew things), but having the puck off a faceoff versus having to steal it away an extra 1 or 2 times out of 10 could make a substantial difference, in my opinion. It increases the efficiency of a line and is less taxing as they would have to do less defensive work.
It may not be the biggest part of puck control, nor worth a huge chunk of salary, but I still maintain that FO% is a relatively important factor to take into account with centres.
by SmellOfVictory on Mar 3, 2010 4:21 PM PST up reply actions
-Why is Conroy better then Boyd? Boyd is faster, more skilled, and plays a good 2 way game. Like I said, love Conny, but his time is up. Sometimes you have to sacrifice that one spot for the future.
-Agreed
-This goes back to Boyd/Conroy for me. If Boyd is still here, I have him 3rd line and Backlund 4th, for soft, development minutes.
-Agreed. I think Sutter is an idiot, but I’m still a Flames fan. Was from 98-04, too.
-The difference between the 4 mil this year and the 675 next year is that now neither of those salaries are on the books. You keep McE past today, you pay him and have no room for a backup. That saved cash can go towards a million for Biron or whomever.
-The Toskalol deal is slightly tilted towards us. He has been a career backup, and when used as a starter, failed miserably.
-The only reason in my mind that Lanks is a 2nd liner and Stajan is a first is chemistry. L-H-K works better then S-H-K.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 4:06 PM PST up reply actions
Conroy is better than Boyd, quite simply, because when he’s on the ice, the Flames outchance the opposition. Greatly. And Conroy doesn’t play particularly soft minutes by my eye.
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 4:10 PM PST up reply actions
I would love to see the Corsi and Zone starts. Chances are great, but you need to produce. And Boyd has produced more then Conroy this year in terms of counting numbers.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 4:47 PM PST up reply actions
Chemistry? What are you, Pierre McGuire?
by Rod Blogojevich on Mar 3, 2010 4:30 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I don’t get it. Lanks has been referred to many times as “instant chemistry.” I’m saying that there is no way the SHK line does as well as the LHK line has thus far.
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Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
by Justin Azevedo on Mar 3, 2010 4:44 PM PST up reply actions
It may not be an empirical piece of information, but I have no doubt that chemistry, in whatever forms it may take, plays a role in effectiveness. Some players communicate more effectively, some may be more erratic in their behaviour, and some may simply have a better awareness of their other linemates. Not every aspect of hockey is measurable.
by SmellOfVictory on Mar 3, 2010 4:54 PM PST up reply actions
From Puck Daddy:
Calgary Flames: The Flames made their “deadline” deals weeks ago with the Dion Phaneuf and Olli Jokinen blockbusters. If there’s a disappointment, it’s that some of the pieces they acquired in that deal didn’t move today. On Wednesday, they made one of the best trades of the day in acquiring defenseman Steve Staios from the Edmonton Oilers for Aaron Johnson and a third-round pick. He’s signed through 2011 at a $2.7 cap hit. Hard-nosed, puck-moving and a great addition by the Flames. They also made a significant upgrade at backup goaltender with Vesa Toskala over Curtis McElhinney, for whatever that’s worth. GRADE: B-
Uh, yeah, dude.
Go Flames Go
Goals? Where we're going, we don't need goals.
how is it that every year the MSM thinks we did well and the bloggers are mortified ?
by walkinvisible on Mar 3, 2010 4:12 PM PST up reply actions
For the record – I’m pretty sure I don’t mind Staios the player. But the $$ attached to him are insane.
Yeah. I’m not sure if it’s an EDM effect or his age or what. But for years he was one of Edmonton’s best at defending. On this team he’ll be thrust into a second pairing role (book it) – we’ll see.
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 4:15 PM PST up reply actions
Third pair with Gio, R O. ;-)
I don’t care about his contract for this year,of course. How Darryl Sutter chooses to set Murray Edwards’ money on fire is between the two of them. My entire problem with the Staios deal is that Sutter will likely have to sacrifice something to move a contract or three this summer. He did the Oil a major favour by accepting Staios’ contract, and it should have been the Flames receiving something extra, not the other way around. Again, it’s the sort of questionable asset management that will bog a team down for a few years. You might not care about draft picks, but given the way that the NHL currently operates, you might as well say you have a moral objection to using money for your personal transactions. Beyond direct acquisition of assets, draft picks are the currency that allows teams to move players around, and the Flames toss them aside like used tissues.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 4:28 PM PST up reply actions
I’m hoping third pair for sure, no doubt it won’t happen though. Aside from the questionable asset management (which I agree with you wholeheartedly), the 3rd round pick indicates that Sutter wanted Staios. Damn. This is like Jokinen here, he’ll be put into a big role I suspect, whether or not he’s ready for it.
by R O on Mar 3, 2010 4:38 PM PST up reply actions
I’d almost prefer him in that role myself.
by Robert Cleave on Mar 3, 2010 5:03 PM PST up reply actions
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